Post by Berg: God of Raiding on Feb 16, 2013 21:49:49 GMT -5
WE'VE BEEN OVER THIS BEFORE: www.threadmeters.com/wow/oPyv8O/Limited_attempts_do_not_work_as_intended/
Why Limited Attempts is a bad idea:
- It won't prevent anyone from seeing "too much" of the boss. Blood Legion will still put in more attempts than anybody else via alt raids.
- Limited Attempts don't make bosses "more prestigious"; Asia will get more attempts because of their shorter raid lockouts, acts of god and disconnects will be responsible for many wipes, and the mechanic encourages the use of exploits and class/spec stacking more than any other pacing mechanic in the game--scenarios that we hope Blizzard wishes to avoid.
- The Limited Attempts mechanic makes raiding tense above all else. It doesn't make an encounter feel more epic, interesting, or fun. The Limited Attempts mechanic is often frustrating: raiding schedules are shifted around so that "the best comp" can be brought in for the attempts, and raids end up standing in place doing absolutely nothing for hours as they wait for their raidmates' internet issues to be resolved.
- I can sabotage any guild whose raid I can get into by using up their limited Ra'den attempts, and there will be no way for them to figure out who sabotaged them.
- I quote my GM of 5 years, who quit the game in Cataclysm and has not returned. To clarify, she was considering returning to the game until she read that Limited Attempts were being reintroduced: "wow, I miss my guild" ... "bam, limited attempts are back" ... "thanks, blizzard, I needed that"
- "Removes any chance for new guild recruits/trials to take part in Ra-den attempts, as well as chastisement for whoever causes the wipe." - Acrosis, THATS NO MOON
- I have never raided with anyone who liked Limited Attempts. I have been raiding for 7 years.
- Blizzard should spend their time making more content, instead of spending their time figuring out how to create the illusion of more content (via Limited Attempts). No one is being fooled.
- Similarly, Algalon was and is a forgettable encounter. Whenever I ask someone what their favorite bosses are, they never ever say Algalon. Tacking Limited Attempts/time limit onto bosses does not make them better--in fact, it has the opposite effect. Raid devs are discouraged from making complex encounters when they know that guilds will only be able to fight it a few times a week. That's bad! When I killed Algalon, I thought to myself, "Finally, no one disconnected." I didn't feel like I had defeated the boss. I felt like I had defeated Time Warner Cable. Is that what you want, Blizzard?
- Raiders who prefer to figure out encounters on their own are going to be punished by the Limited Attempts mechanic. Anyone who pulls Ra'den without having watched a YouTube video of a kill will be labeled insane--which is very unfortunate. What about the raiders who don't want to spoil fights for themselves by watching videos and having strategies for them beforehand? What about the raiders who enjoy playing the game "blind", without outside help or intervention? These raiders are going to be forced to choose between spoiling Ra'den for themselves or wiping and aggravating their raidmates.
- Limited Attempts is yet another method of control. While the video game industry evolves rapidly to give players as much freedom and choices as possible, Blizzard continues to attempt to control its customers--and then they wonder why their subscription numbers are falling. Why are you trying to take away my ability to fight a boss 999999999 times? Stop it. Let me do what I want. This is a video game and I want to play it in the way that I choose. If you want to choose for me, I'll unsubscribe.
In conclusion, I'd like to say that I'm surprised at the outpouring of support against the mere mention of the return of Limited Attempts. Today I logged on to about ten Battle.net whispers--people from Exodus, Blood Legion, and vodka begging me to bitch about this. So here you go. I can't do it on my own, though. Be loud about this. Threaten Blizzard on every forum you can. Cancel your subs and tell them why (you can still play after unsubbing, until your next payment is due). Whine and complain about it to your friends, on Real ID, on MMO Champion, on WoWProgress. Make threads, tweet Ghostcrawler about it--do not stop until it's overturned (which it will be).
It's pathetic that both we and Blizzard have to waste so much time on this AGAIN, when they could spend all this time and all these resources on making great new bosses instead of trying to reintroduce mechanics that everyone despises.
Why Limited Attempts is a bad idea:
- It won't prevent anyone from seeing "too much" of the boss. Blood Legion will still put in more attempts than anybody else via alt raids.
- Limited Attempts don't make bosses "more prestigious"; Asia will get more attempts because of their shorter raid lockouts, acts of god and disconnects will be responsible for many wipes, and the mechanic encourages the use of exploits and class/spec stacking more than any other pacing mechanic in the game--scenarios that we hope Blizzard wishes to avoid.
- The Limited Attempts mechanic makes raiding tense above all else. It doesn't make an encounter feel more epic, interesting, or fun. The Limited Attempts mechanic is often frustrating: raiding schedules are shifted around so that "the best comp" can be brought in for the attempts, and raids end up standing in place doing absolutely nothing for hours as they wait for their raidmates' internet issues to be resolved.
- I can sabotage any guild whose raid I can get into by using up their limited Ra'den attempts, and there will be no way for them to figure out who sabotaged them.
- I quote my GM of 5 years, who quit the game in Cataclysm and has not returned. To clarify, she was considering returning to the game until she read that Limited Attempts were being reintroduced: "wow, I miss my guild" ... "bam, limited attempts are back" ... "thanks, blizzard, I needed that"
- "Removes any chance for new guild recruits/trials to take part in Ra-den attempts, as well as chastisement for whoever causes the wipe." - Acrosis, THATS NO MOON
- I have never raided with anyone who liked Limited Attempts. I have been raiding for 7 years.
- Blizzard should spend their time making more content, instead of spending their time figuring out how to create the illusion of more content (via Limited Attempts). No one is being fooled.
- Similarly, Algalon was and is a forgettable encounter. Whenever I ask someone what their favorite bosses are, they never ever say Algalon. Tacking Limited Attempts/time limit onto bosses does not make them better--in fact, it has the opposite effect. Raid devs are discouraged from making complex encounters when they know that guilds will only be able to fight it a few times a week. That's bad! When I killed Algalon, I thought to myself, "Finally, no one disconnected." I didn't feel like I had defeated the boss. I felt like I had defeated Time Warner Cable. Is that what you want, Blizzard?
- Raiders who prefer to figure out encounters on their own are going to be punished by the Limited Attempts mechanic. Anyone who pulls Ra'den without having watched a YouTube video of a kill will be labeled insane--which is very unfortunate. What about the raiders who don't want to spoil fights for themselves by watching videos and having strategies for them beforehand? What about the raiders who enjoy playing the game "blind", without outside help or intervention? These raiders are going to be forced to choose between spoiling Ra'den for themselves or wiping and aggravating their raidmates.
- Limited Attempts is yet another method of control. While the video game industry evolves rapidly to give players as much freedom and choices as possible, Blizzard continues to attempt to control its customers--and then they wonder why their subscription numbers are falling. Why are you trying to take away my ability to fight a boss 999999999 times? Stop it. Let me do what I want. This is a video game and I want to play it in the way that I choose. If you want to choose for me, I'll unsubscribe.
In conclusion, I'd like to say that I'm surprised at the outpouring of support against the mere mention of the return of Limited Attempts. Today I logged on to about ten Battle.net whispers--people from Exodus, Blood Legion, and vodka begging me to bitch about this. So here you go. I can't do it on my own, though. Be loud about this. Threaten Blizzard on every forum you can. Cancel your subs and tell them why (you can still play after unsubbing, until your next payment is due). Whine and complain about it to your friends, on Real ID, on MMO Champion, on WoWProgress. Make threads, tweet Ghostcrawler about it--do not stop until it's overturned (which it will be).
It's pathetic that both we and Blizzard have to waste so much time on this AGAIN, when they could spend all this time and all these resources on making great new bosses instead of trying to reintroduce mechanics that everyone despises.
